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Lars Brinkhoff 7891748263 Update saved GitHub data.
2018-06-07 17:44:24 +02:00

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"body": "Actually, it's a duplication of a part of itself. Looks like about 512 words, maybe a disk block?"
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"body": "The SAIL version of SAIL characters from MONCOM is https://archive.org/stream/monitorcommand00brucrich#page/116/mode/1up or http://www.saildart.org/allow/sail-charset-utf8.html.\r\n\r\nAs you can see, the differences are:\r\n\r\n* The MIT SAIL is all graphic characters; control is a modifier. Stanford has the ASCII characters used by TOPS-10 in the regular places.\r\n\r\n* Underscore and caret are in the standard ASCII places at MIT, but swapped with pre-ANSI USACII arrows at SAIL.\r\n"
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"body": "ITS already does all this.\r\n\r\nFrom SYSDOC; ITSTTY 41:\r\n\r\n> Programs which make their output depend on the screen size will be totally screwed when the user detaches and reattaches on a different terminal, unless they are specially hacked to recover. Such programs should either enable the %PIATY interrupt, or test %TSATY in the TTYSTS variable regularly, since if the user switches terminal type for any reason those conditions will certainly be signaled. When the interrupt happens or %TSATY is seen, the program should read the screen size and TTYOPT once again from the system and take appropriate actions if they have changed.\r\n> \r\n> In the system, the horizontal size plus 1 is stored in the TCMXH variable, and the vertical size is stored in the TCMXV variable.\r\n"
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"body": "Thank you, @MMcM. The Knight TV font, SUPDUP RFC 734, and the CADR character set all agree.\r\n\r\nI found a variation of the SAIL charset in RFC 698. It looks like the usual SAIL, plus ITS characters added in various places.\r\n\r\nThe table below highlights the differences.\r\n\r\n| OCTAL | SAIL | RFC 698 | ITS\r\n| --- | --- | --- | ---\r\n| 000 | | · | ·\r\n| 011 | | γ | γ\r\n| 012 | | δ | δ\r\n| 013 | | ∫ | ↑\r\n| 014 | | ±| ±\r\n| 015 | | ⊕| ⊕\r\n| 030 | _ | _ | ←\r\n| 032 | ~ | ~ | ≠\r\n| 033 | ≠ |≠ | ◊\r\n| 136 | ↑ | ↑ | ^\r\n| 137 | ← | ← | _\r\n| 175 | ALT | ◊ | }\r\n| 176 | } | } | ~\r\n| 177 | | ^ | ∫"
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"body": "I believe I saw claims that ITS response times can suffer when using this in KLH10. @bictorv? I'm testing it out now and haven't noticed anything so far."
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"body": "Timing is off, as described here: http://up.update.uu.se/idleup"
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"body": "I don't know about response times, but the idle time calculations go crazy with the idling instruction. It can likely be hacked around, if anyone cares enough."
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"body": "It could also be that PEEK goes bonkers in SIMH - it will ty to update the display continuously."
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"body": "SYSNET; TELSER 173\r\n\r\nThe code below INPIN2 looks for a 300 escape octet.\r\n\r\nSUPNEG receives the terminal settings and stores them in TCTYP, TTYOPT, TCMXV, TCMXH, TTYROL, TTYSMT, ISPEED, and OSPEED. It goes on to call SUPNG2 which sets the STY settings."
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"body": "I asked rms if he knew where to find old versions of ITS. He said he didn't. Dunno if there would be anymore likely than him to know where to find it, if it does still exist somewhere. "
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"body": "@ericsoderstrom Thank you. We're in touch with Richard Greenblatt, which is one of the authors of the first versions of ITS. There are also some people at MIT working on preserving their old backup tapes."
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"body": "Seems like this needs quux;schmac fasl (or quux; schmac >) to compile."
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"body": "Where do we want to put this executable? In ALAN;TS SRDATE, or some other (better, sys*) place?"
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"body": "I tried to use EXPN and VRFY with an SMTP server, but it didn't support those commands."
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"body": "I have been using SYS3 for binaries that are either new, or used to be in a random user dir."
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"body": "I don't see any QUUX directory. But on MC, there is an ALAN; SCHMAC LSP and an NSCHEM; SCHMAC LSP and FASL."
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"body": "NAME is quite picky about the network configuration. I have seen this failure before, but I don't remember what it was."
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"body": "Anyone remember how many frame buffers there were? And how many TVs? Since each frame buffer was 32kB, and there are only 64kB in the PDP-11 address space, they must have made extensive use of bank-switching to allow the TV-11 to get to it all. TK mentioned that the PDP-10 rendered all the graphics. I remember vaguely that the PDP-11 was the character generator, though I'm guessing there might have been special hardware to assist. For the multi-font XGP (Xerox Graphics Printer) _that_ PDP-11 did all the font rendering in code \"bummed to within an inch of its life,\" recalls TK."
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"body": "I think the number of PDP-11s connected were limited by the address space of the Rubin 10-11 interface. It occupied one of AI's four mobies. One moby can address 16 64k spaces, but somehow I recall seeing the number 8 as the maximum."
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"body": "It was intended that it also run on ITS, but we ran low on ITS machines by the time it was working."
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"created_at": "2017-05-24T10:16:48Z",
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"body": "Thanks @sraustein. From the looks of it, it was supposed to be compiled with KCC, not the older C10. Do you know if KCC ever made it to ITS?"
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"created_at": "2017-05-24T14:23:08Z",
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"body": "Yes, it was written assuming KCC, and no, as far as I can remember, KCC never made it to ITS. Which was one of the main reasons why CHIVES never did either."
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"body": "Odd! I just got an alert on this today! I did the start of a 340 simulation, but never debugged it.\r\n\r\nThe WEIRD thing about hooking it into SIMH is that ITS runs on a simulation of the KS10, which didn't have an I/O Bus, and (I believe) used different bit patterns for I/O instructions than earlier machines. It might result in ugliness splicing the code in (hopefully no instruction bit patterns for the 340 display processor overlap with any that have meaning on the KS10, or a different/safe I/O device number will have to be found).\r\n\r\nLyle Bickley (who was a member of the PDP-1 restoration team at CHM) has been in touch with me about the very same thing VERY recently!\r\n\r\nThe Type 30 display on the PDP-1 is VERY dumb, but when I did the VT11 display controller for the PDP-11 (to run Lunar Lander!) I had to make it \"steal cycles\" to run the display list (as will be needed for the 340 display processor). Doug Gwyn did a GREAT DEAL of work on the VT11 code, so WHEN deficiencies in the 340 simulation are found (and I'm SURE there will), I'd suggest looking at the VT11 code for (at the very least) a better solution than the one I wrote (I'm STILL, TOTALLY not a graphics programmer)\r\n \r\nISTR someone is working on KA10 and KI10 simulation in ITS, but the KA paging box would have to be simulated (presumably close to what the KS10 simulator does). It doesn't look like the KA10 AI (which was attached to the PDP-6/340) had any DEC disk drives, but ML did..."
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"body": "> I just got an alert on this today!\r\n\r\nMy mistake. I @-mentioned your ITS username instead of your GitHub one. When I edited it yesterday, the alert was sent.\r\n\r\nLyle wrote to the ITS-hackers mailing list about the 340, which is why I went looking here for information.\r\n\r\n@rcornwell reports having done much of the KA10 and ITS pager. I need to find the time to support him with standalone ITS tools and bootable images."
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"body": "Anyway, I updated my bridge program so it deals with Chaos-over-Ethernet, Chaos-over-UDP, and (although I haven't had time to test it yet) Chaos-over-unix-sockets. This time it's almost modular, so adding other protocols such as Chaos-over-IP-type-16 would be doable, but I have no such implementation to test it with. The program does Chaosnet routing info (RUT packets) when connecting subnets.\r\n\r\nIf you want to try it, send me a message - it may need a little bit more work before being let out to the open public."
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"body": "Sounds great!\r\n\r\nI have no immediate need; I'm quite happy as long as the UDP version works ok. And I haven't worked much on ITS for some time because it seems most of the important things are done."
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"body": "I would like to set up chaosnet between ES-ITS and UP, so please keep me informed and let me know when I should try it. (I never set this up with your earlier code, but kept meaning to). — Eric\n\n> On Aug 10, 2017, at 08:56, Lars Brinkhoff <notifications@github.com> wrote:\n> \n> Sounds great!\n> \n> I have no immediate need; I'm quite happy as long as the UDP version works ok. And I haven't worked much on ITS for some time because it seems most of the important things are done.\n> \n> —\n> You are receiving this because you were mentioned.\n> Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub <https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/17#issuecomment-321594489>, or mute the thread <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AA0-Y03hUTnow2DKaEdvX385GuxOkBAeks5sWygigaJpZM4K7Wdo>.\n> \n\n"
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"body": "Eric, I think that should be possible without the new bridge. KLH10 already includes code for tunneling Chaosnet packets in UDP. And the ITS repository is set up for using it when appropriately configured."
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"body": "Eric: I suggest you pick an address on net 6 (check UP: SYSHST;H3TEXT > for what's taken) and then tell me your IP address so I can open up the firewall for you.\r\n\r\nThe bridge program is mostly useful if you're (in addition to klh10) running one of the Lisp Machine emulators.\r\nEdit: or if you want to interconnect two Chaosnets running Lisp Machines, of course."
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"created_at": "2017-08-10T21:10:13Z",
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"body": "How ‘bout \n\nCHAOS 3160, 54.174.143.211 : ES-ITS.SWENSON.ORG, ES, PDP-10 : ITS : :\n\nDoes that work? — Eric\n\n> On Aug 10, 2017, at 13:29, Björn Victor <notifications@github.com> wrote:\n> \n> Eric: I suggest you pick an address on net 6 (check UP: SYSHST;H3TEXT > for what's taken) and then tell me your IP address so I can open up the firewall for you.\n> \n> The bridge program is mostly useful if you're (in addition to klh10) running one of the Lisp Machine emulators.\n> \n> —\n> You are receiving this because you were mentioned.\n> Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub <https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/17#issuecomment-321664543>, or mute the thread <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AA0-YzcTC8uLDbfwco7v4VBxsg2QNrk-ks5sW2g7gaJpZM4K7Wdo>.\n> \n\n"
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"body": "It now works with Unix sockets as well. I have connected UP (the ITS, using Chaos-over-UDP) with a LambdaDelta (lisp machine emulator, using Chaos-over-Ether) and a usim (lisp machine emulator, using Chaos-over-unix-sockets). Did someone have a spec for Chaos-over-IP?"
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"body": "I don't have a spec, I just saw that there's a reserved number for the Chaos packet type in IP."
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"body": "The closest to a \"spec\" might be the PDP-10/X FPGA running ITS, was Chaos-over-IP ever actually used? Since I've never seen it out in the wild, though I haven't checked the old Unix Chaosnet code.\r\n\r\nThe PDP-10/X all it does is shove a Chaos packet as the payload in an IP packet, with 16 as the protocol number.\r\n\r\n@bictorv I'm interested in the bridge code, please!"
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"body": "The bridge program is now available at https://github.com/bictorv/chaosnet-bridge - have fun, don't hesitate to ask me if you need!"
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"body": "Looks good to me. Should the -u and -U flags be documented? "
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"body": "Yes, they should."
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"body": "The interaction between the build script and the PDP-10 console isn't 100% solid. Sometimes the build will get stuck at some point. If you restart the build, does it work?"
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"body": "No it does not. I have tried both Simh and KLH10 as well and it doesn't\nmake a difference. Also of note, I am using the new Xubuntu 17.10.\n\nOn Oct 24, 2017 1:27 AM, \"Lars Brinkhoff\" <notifications@github.com> wrote:\n\n> The interaction between the build script and the PDP-10 console isn't 100%\n> solid. Sometimes the build will get stuck at some point. If you restart the\n> build, does it work?\n>\n> —\n> You are receiving this because you authored the thread.\n> Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub\n> <https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/591#issuecomment-338877999>, or mute\n> the thread\n> <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ARKh59RN06WmL5rGgAHNSFVjsH-I5fXSks5svXVQgaJpZM4QDpP8>\n> .\n>\n"
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"body": "I think you may have forgotten to include `EMULATOR=klh10` when running make.\r\n\r\nThe message `THE KS-10 CLOCK HAS BEEN RESET` should only apprear when using SIMH."
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"created_at": "2017-11-03T00:48:16Z",
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"body": "I got it to work by doing a complete from scratch build so you can close\nit.\n\nThanks\n\nRay\n\nOn Oct 24, 2017 7:45 AM, \"Lars Brinkhoff\" <notifications@github.com> wrote:\n\n> I think you may have forgotten to include EMULATOR=klh10 when running\n> make.\n>\n> The message THE KS-10 CLOCK HAS BEEN RESET should only apprear when using\n> SIMH.\n>\n> —\n> You are receiving this because you authored the thread.\n> Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub\n> <https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/591#issuecomment-338963363>, or mute\n> the thread\n> <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ARKh50lI96j_BgDKuqK44OhOCrTK9Fvkks5svc3kgaJpZM4QDpP8>\n> .\n>\n"
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"body": "Great!"
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"created_at": "2017-11-16T16:02:41Z",
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"body": "Would a tcpdump of all UDP packets be ok?"
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"body": "More than ok!"
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"body": "Result from running `:UP UP`. @bictorv there's nothing secret in here, is there?\r\n\r\nThere's probably some chatter going on unrelated to the STATUS request.\r\n\r\n[up.txt](https://github.com/PDP-10/its/files/1479677/up.txt)\r\n"
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"body": "Reading a file, probably using the MLDEV service.\r\n\r\n[file.txt](https://github.com/PDP-10/its/files/1479702/file.txt)\r\n"
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"body": "It just looks like an old STATUS ANS the new RFC from the :UP command, and some replies to that.\r\n\r\nWhat do you need the Chaos pkt dumps for? (You can find some Chaosnet traffic on Update's Ethernet...) And by the way the chaosnet-bridge now supports TIME and UPTIME in addition to STATUS and DUMP-ROUTING-TABLE."
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"body": "The chatter I was referring to is that there are some packets sent even if I'm not doing anything on the network. Most look like this and are sent to UP:\r\n\r\n 0x0000: 4500 005c 03d2 4000 4011 f276 ac1f 0164 E..\\..@.@..v...d\r\n 0x0010: 82ee 13d7 a43a a43a 0048 44a2 0101 0000 .....:.:.HD.....\r\n 0x0020: 0900 0025 0663 b01d 0668 901f 0002 0005 ...%.c...h......\r\n 0x0030: 6f43 6e6e 6365 6974 6e6f 6420 656f 2073 oCnnceitnod.eo.s\r\n 0x0040: 6f6e 2074 7865 7369 2074 7461 7420 6968 on.txesi.ttat.ih\r\n 0x0050: 2073 6e65 c164 0663 0668 5bb5 .sne.d.c.h[.\r\n\r\nTranslated: \"Connection.does.not.exist.at.this.end\"."
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"body": "Perfect! Thank you! Debug purposes (I don't have a decent setup for ITS currently), writing a plugin for Wireshark and fixing this horrible Linux Chaos driver."
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"created_at": "2017-11-16T18:43:26Z",
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"body": "Argh, wireshark doesn't handle text tcpdump sensible. Is a pcap dump possible? Otherwise, I'll write something."
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"created_at": "2017-11-16T19:01:05Z",
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"body": "Sorted! These can be converted using the text2pcap program, maybe adding an IP header or UDP header in the process.\r\n\r\n[file-converted.txt](https://github.com/PDP-10/its/files/1479824/file-converted.txt)\r\n[up-converted.txt](https://github.com/PDP-10/its/files/1479826/up-converted.txt)\r\n\r\n"
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"created_at": "2017-11-22T22:31:20Z",
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"body": "Building an 8-disk ITS runs into a snag under KLH10: Specifying 8 disk image files in the DSKDMP.INI file causes the message at the end of the following to appear:\r\n\r\n**\r\nKLH10# ; Define basic KS10 device config - two RH11s each on its own Unibus\r\nKLH10#\r\nKLH10# devdef rh0 ub1 rh11 addr=776700 br=6 vec=254\r\nKLH10# devdef rh1 ub3 rh11 addr=772440 br=6 vec=224\r\nKLH10#\r\nKLH10# ; Provide one disk, one tape in config ITS expects\r\nKLH10#\r\nKLH10# devdef dsk0 rh0.0 rp type=rp06 format=dlw8 path=../../out/its.0.rp06 iodly=0\r\nKLH10# devdef dsk1 rh0.1 rp type=rp06 format=dlw8 path=../../out/its.1.rp06 iodly=0\r\nKLH10# devdef dsk2 rh0.2 rp type=rp06 format=dlw8 path=../../out/its.2.rp06 iodly=0\r\nKLH10# devdef dsk3 rh0.3 rp type=rp06 format=dlw8 path=../../out/its.3.rp06 iodly=0\r\nKLH10# devdef dsk4 rh0.4 rp type=rp06 format=dlw8 path=../../out/its.4.rp06 iodly=0\r\nKLH10# devdef dsk5 rh0.5 rp type=rp06 format=dlw8 path=../../out/its.5.rp06 iodly=0\r\nKLH10# devdef dsk6 rh0.6 rp type=rp06 format=dlw8 path=../../out/its.6.rp06 iodly=0\r\nKLH10# devdef dsk7 rh0.7 rp type=rp06 format=dlw8 path=../../out/its.7.rp06 iodly=0\r\nKLH10#\r\nKLH10# devdef mta0 rh1.0 tm02 fmtr=tm03 type=tu45\r\nKLH10#\r\nKLH10# ; ITS wants a 60Hz clock, allow it. Need this until defaults OK.\r\nKLH10# set clk_ithzfix=60\r\n clk_ithzfix: 60. => 60.\r\nKLH10#\r\nKLH10# ; Define IMP for PI on ITS.JOSS.COM\r\nKLH10# devdef imp ub3 lhdh addr=767600 br=6 vec=250 ipaddr=172.16.36.247 gwaddr=172.16.36.1\r\nOut of room for more device defs\r\nKLH10#\r\n**\r\n\r\nI have increased KLH10_DEVMAX from 20 to 31, then to 63, in kn10dev.c, with no change in the occurrence of the error message.\r\n\r\nIdeas, anyone?\r\n"
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"body": "I mentioned it in the other issue: The Makefile system contains an override -DKLH10_DEVMAX=12. Could that be the problem?"
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"created_at": "2017-12-04T21:05:48Z",
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"body": "The LSPMAN directory exists on AI and SV."
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"body": "- Mount the MAGDMP magtape: Start SIMH and enter \"at mta0 magdmp.tap\".\r\n- Boot from the MAGDMP paper tape: Enter \"load -r magdmp.rim\", then \"go\".\r\n- You should now be able to access the magtape. \"F <ALTMODE>\" should display a file listing. \"filename <CR>\" should load and start a standalone program.\r\n\r\nFor more MAGDMP commands, check [SYSENG; MAGDMP 28](https://github.com/PDP-10/its/blob/master/src/syseng/magdmp.28)."
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"created_at": "2017-12-07T09:12:59Z",
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"body": "I'll close this for now."
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"body": "@rcornwell I will try to add information here about how to build KA10 standalone programs, paper tapes, magtape images, operating instructions, etc."
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"body": "- Make exec DDT: Assemble SYSTEM; DDT. Answer \"0\" to cpusw to build for a KA10. One disk and RH-10 I suppose? EDIT: **wrong**, no disk.\r\n- Make DSKDMP paper tape: Assemble SYSTEM; DSMDMP. Answer \"y\" to the paper tape question. Etc."
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"body": "CC @rcornwell "
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"body": "If I mount a MAGFRM tape, boot MAGDMP, and type `L$` to see the directory, I get a hang."
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"body": "@jeffpar \r\nThe tape images mentioned in this issue may also be useful to you for testing your JavaScript KA10 simulator."
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"body": "@larsbrinkhoff and @hrlzm, I have quite a lot of Essex BCPL stuff available, but it's not quite up and running yet. I have this in my <bcpl> directory in the Panda system, restored from an old tape image:\r\n TOPS20:<BCPL>\r\n BCPL.DOC.1;P775250 3 6860(7) 11-Apr-84 00:40:35\r\n .EXE.1;P775250 26 66560(7) 8-Aug-84 18:32:10\r\n .GUI.1;P775250 26 65914(7) 11-Apr-84 01:30:03 \r\n .HELP.1;P775252 2 3300(7) 11-Apr-84 01:39:30\r\n .MAN.1;P775250 68 173890(7) 11-Apr-84 00:42:57\r\n BCPL00.EXE.1;P775250 33 84480(7) 8-Aug-84 18:57:36\r\n BCPL01.EXE.1;P775250 36 92160(7) 8-Aug-84 23:12:28\r\n BCPL02.EXE.1;P775250 26 66560(7) 8-Aug-84 23:57:19\r\n BCPL03.EXE.1;P775250 7 17920(7) 9-Aug-84 00:14:15\r\n\r\n Total of 227 pages in 9 files\r\n\r\nI managed to compile a test program, but i can't LOAD it because the system is missing BCPLIB.REL. I do have a set of source files, ostensibly for BCPLIB and others, but I haven't tried transferring them or building anything from them yet:\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 612 Jul 25 1996 acs.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 0 Jul 25 1996 bclrun.000\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 850 Jul 25 1996 bclrun.bcp\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 6699 Jul 25 1996 bcpl.doc\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 64332 Jul 25 1996 bcpl.gui\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 3210 Jul 25 1996 bcpl.hlp\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 907 Jul 25 1996 bcplib.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 139547 Jul 25 1996 bcplib.mas\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 169064 Jul 25 1996 bcpl.man\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 700 Jul 25 1996 bits.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 764 Jul 25 1996 errors.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 213 Jul 25 1996 iolib.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 397 Jul 25 1996 iopack.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 162 Jul 25 1996 iouuo.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 284 Jul 25 1996 jobdat.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 332 Jul 25 1996 kernel.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 1316 Jul 25 1996 rfs.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 405 Jul 25 1996 rfslib.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 23072 Jul 25 1996 rfslib.mas\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 2845 Jul 25 1996 scb.get\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 82 Jul 25 1996 test.bcl\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 410 Jul 25 1996 test.lst\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 1123 Jul 25 1996 trans.tbl\r\n-r--r--r-- 1 hansl hansl 193 Jul 25 1996 useful.get\r\n"
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"body": "@hansliss Great! @hrlzm's tape image is here: \r\nhttps://github.com/PDP-10/essex-bcpl"
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"body": "I think the format is like this:\r\n\r\n- The first tape file is MAGDMP.\r\n - The first 16 words are the HRI loader.\r\n- The following files are alternating headers and data.\r\n - A header file should start with a three-word record consisting of FN1, FN2, and version.\r\n - Other header records are ignored.\r\n - A data file is the file contents corresponding to the previous header. It should be a program in SBLK format."
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"body": "It seems like KS ITS when run in SIMH, doesn't write the tape correctly."
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"body": "Thanks! I'll take a look at it.\n\nI have a tape drive (in Uppsala, Sweden) if anyone needs to read tapes,\nby the way. I have a Linux box connected to it, with scripts to dump\ntapes to raw files, so it's easy to build virtual tapes for klh10.\n\n/Hans\n\n\nOn 2017-12-11 07:20, Lars Brinkhoff wrote:\n>\n> @hansliss <https://github.com/hansliss> Great! @hrlzm\n> <https://github.com/hrlzm>'s tape image is here:\n> https://github.com/PDP-10/essex-bcpl\n>\n> —\n> You are receiving this because you were mentioned.\n> Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub\n> <https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/416#issuecomment-350632493>, or\n> mute the thread\n> <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ABDuEEcsyGZaDmNGFDF9-lSRkJPKYMDyks5s_MmpgaJpZM4LioxW>.\n>\n\n"
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"body": "Tested with KLH10, same thing."
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"body": "It could be a problem with MAGFRM, or with the KS monitor tape driver, SYSTEM; NMTAPE >."
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"body": "Thanks @ams. We know it's there, but not quite what to do about the files. I don't want to add full directory contents; instead individual files should be studied to know their purpuse and to ensure there's no private data inside.\r\n\r\nIs there something in particular you're missing?"
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"created_at": "2017-12-12T13:44:10Z",
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"body": "Ah, thought it had missed the radar. I was looking for traces of how the Lisp Machine Manual front/back cover was generated and poked into the ITS files. Any hints on that would be appreciated!"
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"body": "If it's the Chineual, you might want to ask @david-moon. There's an email address here: http://users.rcn.com/david-moon/PLOT3/"
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"created_at": "2017-12-12T22:00:31Z",
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"body": "I think I already sent an email that way without a ping. Will try again."
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"created_at": "2017-12-14T09:09:11Z",
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"body": "Fixed by PDP-10/klh10#28."
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"created_at": "2017-12-14T12:22:07Z",
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"body": "With the help of SIMH debug logging, I see that ITS doesn't correctly space to the logical end-of-tape. It just spaces forward one record.\r\n\r\nI'm now using exec DDT to see what's going on in SYSTEM; NMTAPE 30. The MGSEOT routine determines that the tape head is at the beginning of the tape, and jumps to MGVTCK to see if it's a virgin tape. That code should see that's not the case, and jump back to MGNVT but it fails to do so."
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"created_at": "2017-12-14T19:21:31Z",
"updated_at": "2018-02-28T08:05:14Z",
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"body": "I found this. If I'm not misrememering the PDP-10 instruction set, TXNE will skip when %TMESS is zero. However, an error is indiated with %TMSES set. I think the condition should be reversed.\r\n\r\n TXNE T,%TMSES ;Formatter error?\r\n JRST MGNVT ;No error, not a new tape"
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"body": "Changing to TXNN is an improvement. Now I can write one data file using MAGFRM. However, writing one more file doesn't work. The second file header overwrites the first data file. Still not spacing to EOT correctly."
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"body": "This is with @rcornwell's KA10 emulator."
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"body": "Fix when done with #594."
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"body": "DSKDMP was built with the wrong number in NUDSL."
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"body": "I'm comparing SALV against NSALV. The file headers are slightly different."
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"body": "Have implemented Unix tools: `magdmp` which will read a tape image and print some information about the contents, and `magfrm` to write some files to a tape image."
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"body": "Fixes needed so far:\r\n- NMTAPE doesn't space to EOT correctly, makes MAGFRM fail.\r\n- Wrote a Unix magfrm to make MAGDMP tapes.\r\n- SALV (old KA/KL salvager) doesn't understand the DUMP tape format.\r\n- Exec DDT needs to be build without disk support for $U to work.\r\n- DSKDMP was built with wrong NUDSL."
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"body": "I updated SALV to ignore one or two words beoynd the original six-word file header."
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"body": "SALV is the old KA/KL salvager. It probably didn't receive updates when other software changed. The KAs went away around 1984, and the KL in 1988. I see the newer KS NSALV added the new format in 1989."
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"created_at": "2017-12-20T07:52:16Z",
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"body": "@mctuva Do you know if TK has any documentation, schematics, blueprints etc for the 10-11 interface?"
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"created_at": "2017-12-20T08:14:06Z",
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"body": "I stumbled across this in SYSTEM; CONFIG >:\r\n\r\n DEFOPT T11CHP==1 ; CHAOS net goes through TEN-11 interface\r\n DEFOPT CH11NM==7 ; # of 10-11 PDP11 handling CHAOS net.\r\n DEFOPT TT11NM==0 ; # of 10-11 PDP11 that handles TV TTYs.\r\n DEFOPT N11TYS==16. ; # PDP11 TV TTYS\r\n\r\nI think this means that one of the 10-11 PDP-11s handles CHAOSnet, and another one handled the Knight TV system. And then there were one PDP-11 for each TV, of which there were 16."
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"created_at": "2017-12-20T09:28:54Z",
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"body": "I don't think one PDP-11 for each TV. The parameter probably just says now many TVs there were attached to one 11."
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"created_at": "2017-12-20T09:52:59Z",
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"body": "@aap Those video links are now broken."
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"created_at": "2017-12-20T10:34:44Z",
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"body": "I can ask. \n\n--Tim\n\n> On Dec 20, 2017, at 02:52, Lars Brinkhoff <notifications@github.com> wrote:\n> \n> @mctuva Do you know if TK has any documentation, schematics, blueprints etc for the 10-11 interface?\n> \n> —\n> You are receiving this because you were mentioned.\n> Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub, or mute the thread.\n> \n"
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"created_at": "2017-12-20T10:35:55Z",
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"body": "That's unfortunate. Maybe I'll drop them an email. Or you do it, I probably won't have time today."
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"created_at": "2017-12-20T10:37:19Z",
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"body": "That sounds like too many 11s. Pretty sure a single 11 could handle multiple TVs. \n\n--Tim\n\n> On Dec 20, 2017, at 03:14, Lars Brinkhoff <notifications@github.com> wrote:\n> \n> I stumbled across this in SYSTEM; CONFIG >:\n> \n> DEFOPT T11CHP==1 ; CHAOS net goes through TEN-11 interface\n> DEFOPT CH11NM==7 ; # of 10-11 PDP11 handling CHAOS net.\n> DEFOPT TT11NM==0 ; # of 10-11 PDP11 that handles TV TTYs.\n> DEFOPT N11TYS==16. ; # PDP11 TV TTYS\n> I think this means that one of the 10-11 PDP-11s handles CHAOSnet, and another one handled the Knight TV system. And then there were one PDP-11 for each TV, of which there were 16.\n> \n> —\n> You are receiving this because you were mentioned.\n> Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub, or mute the thread.\n> \n"
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"body": "Maybe check archive.org if they got archived?"
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"created_at": "2017-12-21T06:33:20Z",
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"body": "Hi Lars,\n\nTK says he has schematics, and will scan them as soon as he has time.\n\nDo you know if the PDP-11 code was preserved anywhere?\nThat is key, since software was at least half the picture.\n\n--Tim\n\nOn 12/20/17 2:52 AM, Lars Brinkhoff wrote:\n>\n> @mctuva <https://github.com/mctuva> Do you know if TK has any \n> documentation, schematics, blueprints etc for the 10-11 interface?\n>\n> —\n> You are receiving this because you were mentioned.\n> Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub \n> <https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/279#issuecomment-352990659>, or \n> mute the thread \n> <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ANh4Hi3Q4x9FpQqJa3WbyInndonK5jUZks5tCLyxgaJpZM4LPLOk>.\n>\n\n"
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"body": "@mctuva That's great!\r\n\r\nWe have the IOELEV and TV files in SYSTEM, and the PALX cross assembler in SYSEN1.\r\n"
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"created_at": "2017-12-21T11:55:35Z",
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"body": "This is about the old KA/KL SYSTEM; SALV >."
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"body": "The branch [lars/salv](https://github.com/PDP-10/its/tree/lars/salv) has a SALV bug fix for reading tapes with dumped links. But it's not much use if writing links to disk don't work."
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"created_at": "2017-12-21T13:45:47Z",
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"body": "Regarding KA.\r\n\r\nSYSTEM; DDT < states:\r\n\r\n 1PRSW==:0 ; DOESN'T WORK!\r\n\r\nAnd it seems to be true, because later it says:\r\n\r\n ONEPRO: JRST ERR ;NOT HACKED YET\r\n"
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"created_at": "2017-12-21T14:19:31Z",
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"body": "From CSAIL webmaster:\r\n> We are in the process of building a new video archive interface, but in the meantime, you can access the videos from the backup copy of our old server:\r\n> http://akron.csail.mit.edu/research/videoarchive\r\n"
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"body": "We now have the MAZE server code for ITS! I checked it in on a branch for now."
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"body": "KA $^N doesn't work right, but it seems to be trying."
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"body": "Video of running KA10.\r\n\r\nhttp://youtu.be/Hm3UY1o7Bdo"
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]
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