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Lars Brinkhoff 7891748263 Update saved GitHub data.
2018-06-07 17:44:24 +02:00

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"body": "@atsampson, you asked about MIDAS from DM ITS. I have been prodding the Infocom people about PDP-10 software, but it seems they don't have any.\r\n\r\nWe do know there were backup tapes being made, but we don't know what happened to them. The Dynamic Modeling organization was quite separate from the AI Lab. DM was closed down around 1980ish, wereas the AI Lab lived on. This may explain why there is a lot more AI Lab material around than from DM.\r\n\r\nI don't want to wear down the patience of the MIT people. Can you ask around?\r\n\r\nI have tried to locate Al Vezza, who was some kind of director or the Dynamic Modeling group, but so far I haven't found any way to contact him."
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"body": "Some random thoughts. Please discuss further.\r\n\r\n- Where should the executabes go?\r\n\r\n I put the original ADVENT in SYS3, because there was such a TS ADVENT in the AI and MC snapshots. It's most likely the wrong ADVENT, though! Feel free to put the right version there if you like.\r\n\r\n I think the other executables should be in EJS or GAMES. They can be plain files, or in an archive. Since archives are so transparent in ITS, they are almost like subdirectories. Since we have three ADVENT versions, one each could go in SYS3, EJS, and GAMES. Bad idea maybe...\r\n\r\n- Where should the source code go?\r\n\r\n I only created GAMES to have some place to put games that didn't exist in the snapshots. Now that we have EJS and BTM1, maybe that's the proper location for all games. This EJS person must have been a hard-core gamer!\r\n\r\n I personally don't think the confusion would be too bad if the files were all in the same directory. But having them in three separate archives is fine too.\r\n\r\n- Building from archives.\r\n\r\n We don't need to extract the files, do we? Just build from the archives. I see some historical binaries were built that way, so we can do that too."
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"body": "I see SYS3; TS ADVENT was a short stub to tell people to use GAME."
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"body": "Right. Back then, we wanted to make sure everyone used NGAME (GAME) rather than the games themselves. NGAME limited usage of games to certain hours and when the load was low and when there were free terminals."
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"body": "I think it would be strange if the version of STINK in the <mld.int> directory wouldn't be able to link the MDL executable. So maybe it's a special version of MIDAS that we need.\r\n\r\nWhat is .LNKOT in END trying to do that confuses MIDAS. Would it be possible to do a workaround by rewriting the macro to do something else?"
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"body": "I think this GAME menu is a good idea even now. It makes it easy to find all games. Maybe just lift the restrictions.\r\n\r\nThere's the matter of what to do with new games. A few can be added to NGAME, but eventually we'd run out of letters."
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"body": "@quentinnuk now has MUD built from sources and running in TOPS-10.\r\n\r\nShould we try to run it in ITS? Maybe it can run as is in TEN50 or DECUUO."
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"body": "There was a problem with DECUUO sending an address with bit 0 set to .DSTART. ITS will interpret this as a BLKO pointer, but DECUUO meant to send the head of a linked list.\r\n\r\nI patched ITS to restrict BLKO pointer to greater than 777000,,0. Now DECUUO starts without complaints. And SUDS loads a DRW file... And... the display stays blank."
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"body": "Patched ITS to make 400000,,0-777000,,0 be a linked list address, and an address above that a BLKO pointer. Now SUDS runs fine, except I haven't been able to make it display anything."
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"body": "I'm pretty convinced now that the older STINK isn't all that different from the current one in terms of what it supports - the biggest differences are in how it handles high-segment linking, because it has the boundary hardcoded at 400000 and modern STINK makes it configurable (but defaulting to 400000). The majority of the code is identical.\r\n\r\n.LNKOT tells MIDAS to dump out all the STINK information that's been accumulated so far. It would otherwise do this at the end of compilation, so trying without it is on my to-do list, as is trying without the PURE/IMPURE stuff."
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"body": "Eric got this message from Bill:\r\n\r\n> Absolutely. You have my permission to use the material in any way you see fit."
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"created_at": "2018-04-16T08:01:42Z",
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"body": "Saildart: \r\nDFTP.DMP[1,3] \r\nDFTP.MRC[UP,DOC] \r\nDFTP.INT[UP,DOC] "
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"body": "http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a015125.pdf\r\n\r\nThe Datacomputer was a TENEX machine with a terabit memory."
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"created_at": "2018-04-16T10:55:48Z",
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"body": "Our copy of MUDDLE; TS MIDAS is version 73. It was backed up 03/09/73."
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"body": "We have a .; @ MIDAS timestamped 1972-12-22. I don't see much in the way of version numbers in it.\r\n\r\nNote that the timestamp may be from a copy. It could turn out to be much older. The same goes for all files of course, but maybe this file is particularly interesting.\r\n\r\nAlso, some files don't have a timestamp, or the timestamp is obviously wrong. But all files have a reliable backup date."
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"body": "Since TM10B uses direct memory access, it has a potential for higher transfer speeds than TM10A which makes an interrupt for every work. However, at this point, the KA10 simulator doesn't have an option to increase the data rate."
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"created_at": "2018-04-16T12:06:01Z",
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"body": "Some more from BACKUP:\r\n\r\n- TS OOMIDAS - version 76, backed up 04/21/72\r\n- TS OMIDAS - version 77, backed up 04/21/72\r\n- TS OLMIDA - version 77, backed up 04/21/72\r\n- MIDAS BIN289 - version 289, timestamp 1976-09-13\r\n\r\nInformation from @atsampson is that 76/77 get an error calling .CBLK. And that version 73 uses .CORE."
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"created_at": "2018-04-16T12:47:33Z",
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"body": "There's a MIDAS 16K from Peter Samson's \"RandomSystem\" DECtape.\r\n\r\nThe symbol table has three sections: MIDAS, MACTAP, and ASSEMB.\r\n\r\nIt uses TD10 device numbers."
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"body": "There will not be a increase in speed since the speed of the tape device was independent of the type of controller used. "
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"body": "A bit more about the options used to build the older MIDAS binaries.\r\n\r\nMOBY=1 produces a bigger symbol table. .SYMTAB was introduced in MIDAS 92 (according to MIDAS ARCHIV); versions from 92 to at least 352 look at their JNAME and dynamically allocate a larger table if they're called MMIDAS or MM, so the naming below suggests that this was done by hand before.\r\n\r\nLISTSW=1 is \"LISTING FEATURE FOR MAINT PROGS\"; it adds an \"L\" option to MIDAS.\r\n\r\nThe binaries were built with:\r\n\r\n- ./files/muddle/ts.midas - MIDAS 73\r\n- ./files/backup/ts.oomida - MIDAS 76\r\n- ./files/backup/ts.oommid - MIDAS 76, MOBY=1\r\n- ./files/backup/ts.omidas - MIDAS 77\r\n- ./files/backup/ts.ommida - MIDAS 77, MOBY=1\r\n- ./files/backup/ts.olmida - MIDAS 77, MOBY=1, LISTSW=1"
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"body": "This file set is checked in as 1b555896ebae8fa122210322e0b01490a9bc02a4"
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"body": "By the way, the BUILD.CMD in that commit here is most definitely the one for ITS. I think the other commit (with later sources?) has a build.cmd for TOPS-20, right? We may wish to try to use the BUILD.CMD with my sources or try that same BUILD.CMD with the later sources."
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"created_at": "2018-04-16T19:45:10Z",
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"body": "No, Bob's file set only has .mud files, no .cmd files. BUILD CMD is from you. I renamed Bob's files and overlaid them on top of yours. Most files were the same, and for the few that differed I increased their version numbers.\r\n\r\nI think BUILD CMD looks like TOPS-20 commands (or TENEX). \"CONN \\<ZORK>\" means connect to the MDL directory."
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"body": "@taa01776, in the top comment in this issue, Eric reveals how he got the Zork source code files. Do you remember this event?"
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"created_at": "2018-04-16T19:49:08Z",
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"body": "These are the changes in Bob's version: 93879ee82fb0b635213739ddc66214e1c2228989"
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"created_at": "2018-04-16T19:54:18Z",
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"body": "I transcribed Bob's story as told in his Get Lamp interview:\r\n\r\n> The game was known as Dungeon at the time I met it. And what happened was it drifed in from MIT, via the ARPAnet. The MIT system that was being used as a development base was called ITS, which stood for the \"Incompatible Timesharing System\", which was a play on a much older MIT system called CTSS, the \"Compatible Time-Sharing System\". And there was a way to run it on a more conventional PDP-10 operating system called TOPS-20 of which there were a few, but only a few, in DEC. Most of them ran an older system called TOPS-10.\r\n> \r\n> And so it drifted in and as usual for a company - relatively small company in those day - the word began to get around that there was this much more elaborate, much more interesting and complicated puzzle/text adventure/problem solving game. And it was extraordinary difficult to get access to it because, as I said, the machines that even DEC owned that could run it were relatively few and far between. And having just come off working with Adventure, I was very eager to learn more about these games and when I saw Dungeon with its full-fledged parser and its far more elaborate descriptive mechanisms and just the general richness of the whole environment, it was very very interesting to me to see it.\r\n> \r\n> And it was also frustrating to play, because access was limited. It was a hard game - much harder than Adventure. And it was incomplete at the time. It was still being elaborated by Marc and Tim and the rest of the MIT gang. There was version skew going on between them and anybody else was playing it.\r\n> \r\n> So the same idea occurred to me which was if it was on a small machine, I'd have access to it. A lot more people would have acess to it, and we'd know more about it. So kind of without quite really understanding what was involved, I decided, well I'll do the same thing. I'll port it. There were only a couple of, sort of, minor assumptions that weren't quite right in my thinking.\r\n> \r\n> The first is of course that it wasn't written in Fortran. It was written in an obscure variant of a functional language like Lisp that was called MDL, Model Development Language. And when I first saw the sources I was like, what is this? I'd just have no clue what I was looking at.\r\n> \r\n> Then the second thing is, it's a much bigger game. The source size for Dungeon at the time was probably five to ten times the size of the Adventure sources. So the notion of trying to shoe-horn this into the machine target I had, which was the smallest most personal PDP-11 of the time, was a bit more daunting.\r\n> \r\n> And then the third problem was it wasn't done. It was changing all the time.\r\n> \r\n> So, well, I didn't know any better. And nonetheless I decided I would do this. I would do it in the only higher-level language that I was really fluent in which was Fortran. C was certainly available but it was probably not a single Unix system in DEC at the time. So Fortran was it.\r\n> \r\n> I bought a book on Muddle from the MIT Press. And started in doing some probe coding. And this was probably in late 1977 or early 1978. And I would not have made a huge amount of progress, except that in early 1978 there occurred what is foundly called the Blizzard of 78, when 26 inches or so of snow fell on the place in early February. And the state was shut down for a week. I was home. I was home with a printed Muddle listings. And the book. And I didn't have anything else to do at the time. So during that week I fundamentally worked out how to represent the data structures and the algorithms in Fortran from the sources I had. And I did a probe coded version of the game with no parser. But nonetheless you could basically type in numerical equivalents for a command and then it would go off and it would do the game action. It would display rooms and do actions and the pirate would show up and the thief would show up and cut your throat and all the good things it's supposed to do.\r\n> \r\n> When I had this running in March of 78 I made contact with the guys at MIT and said, hey you know, it's possible to run this on a much smaller machine. Would you be interested in supporting this by actually giving me the complete source set as opposed to the fragment that I had. They came out to where I was working, and I was actually working right across the divide here in the other building. And they were completely astounded to see that what they regarded as a mainframe large scale program was running on this - from their point of view - tiny machine. They agreed to provide the full source set so that I could port as much of the game as existed at the time. So for really the first half of 78, I finished off an initial complete implementation and put that out in DECUS. Their one condition was that the big database file, the text file, that sort of had all the strings couldn't be published in unencrypted form.\r\n> \r\n> And then basically as new inputs came in - they finished the endgame and so forth - I kept up with what they were doing for about the next eighteen months.\r\n"
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"body": "I've now got most of the 1973 MUDDLE source to assemble with current MIDAS and load successfully into current STINK (provided you fix the \"bad format\" problem mentioned above): https://github.com/PDP-10/muddle/tree/ats/its73\r\n\r\nBut the NUPRM source turns into binary junk halfway through, so I haven't been able to assemble it, and the symbols it provides (at least) are missing at the end of the link process. This is the equivalent of PRIMIT in the <mdl.int> source, so it's not really something we can do without; it'd need to be reconstructed from some combination of the newer PRIMIT and the TS MUDDLE binary.\r\n\r\nBy instrumenting STINK further, I've found two different causes of the nonsense pointer problem above:\r\n\r\n- With the 1973 source, I was initially using MIDAS 73. For most files, it was producing reasonable input to STINK, but for EVAL, MIDAS was producing link requests without the bit set that indicates that the address of the location to be updated should be relocated. Hence the bad pointer. MIDAS sets that bit (in LNKPRO) if it thinks the location of the symbol has been relocated; it was apparently getting confused by the junk after the END directive in that file, and removing it fixed it!\r\n\r\n- With the <mdl.int> source, and current MIDAS, MIDAS emits reasonable-looking link requests, but STINK sometimes relocates the address in them incorrectly. There's a good example of this when MUDDLE first uses its DOTCAL macro: it defines a symbol as . with some data after it, and MIDAS emits a link request for that symbol with the right address in, but the relocated location that STINK saves in its symbol table (from THRDR's call to RELOCT) isn't where it actually put the following data."
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"body": "I've found at least one feature that MIDAS and STINK know about that's not in that document: extend code 2 in a standard data block can also be used to rename or expunge symbols, depending on the value you pass. See the code in LOCGLO in STINK."
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"created_at": "2018-04-17T16:44:26Z",
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"body": "I think I spoke to soon. SUDS does not run fine. It runs further along, but then ITS halts. At that point, a few .DSTART calls have been made. According to debug output, some reasonable looking words have been transferred to the 340. But near the end is more supicious data.\r\n\r\nHere's an example. Two 18-bit words with 403737. Does that make sense?\r\n\r\n```\r\nDBG(1138177760)> DPY DEBTAB_ISNULL: DPY 131 DATO 403737403737 PC=001341^M\r\ntype340 mode 03 status 0^M\r\ntype340 char 403737^M\r\ntype340 mode 0 status 0^M\r\ntype340 reserved param bits set 0403737^M\r\ntype340 set intensity 7^M\r\ntype340 set scale 2^M\r\ntype340 stop^M\r\ntype340 stop int^M\r\n"
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"body": "Full log attached.\r\n[340.log](https://github.com/PDP-10/its/files/1920773/340.log)\r\n"
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"body": "Too bad NUPRM is damaged.\r\n\r\nI don't know, but I believe the MUDDLE files didn't come from the DynaMod ITS machine. It's possible that someone made a copy and tried to build it with MIDAS and/or STINK versions that couldn't quite cope. Maybe that explains why TS MUDDLE doesn't work. We don't know if TS MIDAS and TS STINK came along with the other files, or if they were put there later."
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"body": "I didn't notice any plotting commands, but all the \"reserved param bits\"\nmessages suggest someone is confused (could be my code) trying to interpret\na command while in the wrong mode.\n\n\nphil@p27:~/Downloads$ grep reserved 340.log | sort -u \ntype340 reserved param bits set 0200000\ntype340 reserved param bits set 0200400\ntype340 reserved param bits set 0201700\ntype340 reserved param bits set 0201740\ntype340 reserved param bits set 0201777\ntype340 reserved param bits set 0333436\ntype340 reserved param bits set 0403737\n\nThe first five could be \"point mode\" commands (200000 specifies\nvertical coordinate), and the last two could be character mode, with\nsix-bit (but not SIXBIT!) characters:\n\n33 is line feed\n34 is carriage return\n36 switches to lower case\n40 is space\n37 is escape from character mode\n\nBut none of the above would plot anything on the screen.\n"
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"body": "I wonder if the Fortran compiler will let you specify sources from archives. I seem to recall trying to specify a directory (as well as FN1.FN2) and this failed. Maybe I did it wrong. In any case, the build could extract the sources from the archive, compile them, and then delete them when it was done. Do you know the syntax that DECSYS; F40 supports? Is there any documentation on this compiler?"
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"body": "Oh, right. No it may well not do that. If you can specify a directory, it could be [dir]filename. I think you can also say device:filename.\r\n\r\nI think there's just this, but it's only the language. http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp10/TOPS10/DEC-10-AFC0-D_PDP-10_FORTRAN_IV_Programming_Manual_Aug69.pdf\r\n\r\n@mattwyrm, do you know if there's a manual for the F40 compiler?"
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"body": "To produce a working Moby MIDAS 77:\r\n\r\n```\r\n:job midas\r\n:load ts ommida\r\n36042/ .core 57\r\n36043/ .value\r\n36044/ jrst 36053\r\n:pdump ts mmid77\r\n:kill\r\n```\r\n\r\nThis replaces the code that uses `.CBLK` on startup - it has a list of pages it's mapping in and out, and somehow in the process ends up unmapping the page with the list of pages in it... (Edit: this is wrong; see below for a better fix.)"
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"body": "Thanks Phil.\r\n\r\nI'm not sure what is supposed to be displayed when SUDS starts. Maybe a little bit of text and a cursor?\r\n\r\nMaybe there's still something wrong with how the display list is passed to the system. Certainly something is wrong when ITS hangs."
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"body": "Thanks @atsampson, that's certainly a small change to make.\r\n\r\nMaybe it shouldn't be too hard to start with MIDAS 108 source code and reconstruct 77, 76, and 73. (But unless it's necesssary for assembling MUDDLE, I don't see a pressing need right now.)"
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"body": "Also, filename translations.\r\n\r\nIf F40 tries to open, say GAMES; ADV448 F, you can add a translation to make it read, say, AR1: GAMES; ADV448 F."
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"body": "Granted, that isn't a huge improvement over copying and deleting.\r\n\r\nBut it's the kind of thing ITS hackers were prone to do."
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"body": "MIT Arpanet hosts:\r\n\r\n**IMP 6**\r\n- Host 0: Multics\r\n- Host 1: MIT-DMS\r\n- Host 2: MIT-AI\r\n- Host 3: MIT-ML\r\n\r\n**IMP 44**\r\n- Host 0: MIT-XX\r\n- Host 2: MIT-TSTGW\r\n- Host 3: MIT-MC\r\n\r\n**IMP 77**\r\n- Host 0: MIT-GW\r\n- Host 1: MIT-DEVMULTICS\r\n- Host 2: MIT-TAC\r\n"
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"body": "Related to this, @atsampson had a great idea: To make an interactive fiction game in the Tech Square universe.\r\n\r\nWe have a map of the ninth floor: \r\nhttp://gunkies.org/wiki/Tech_Square"
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"body": "Only vaguely.\r\nI was a little disappointed that Bob’s story about translating Zork didn’t mention how *he* got the sources. Not that different from Eric’s, but there was a third party involved, along with ITS 1.5 documentation and a DEC-20 running acceptance. Good times.\r\n -ta\r\n\r\n\r\nFrom: Lars Brinkhoff [mailto:notifications@github.com]\r\nSent: Monday, 16 April, 2018 15:46\r\nTo: PDP-10/its <its@noreply.github.com>\r\nCc: Anderson, Timothy A. <taa@stresearch.com>; Mention <mention@noreply.github.com>\r\nSubject: Re: [PDP-10/its] Zork story by EJS (#813)\r\n\r\n\r\n@taa01776<https://github.com/taa01776>, in the top comment in this issue, Eric reveals how he got the Zork source code files. Do you remember this event?\r\n\r\n—\r\nYou are receiving this because you were mentioned.\r\nReply to this email directly, view it on GitHub<https://github.com/PDP-10/its/issues/813#issuecomment-381726116>, or mute the thread<https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ABnTXXXRfDwZQhzdNK-RwM3n_B5XTYjnks5tpPUJgaJpZM4TXGJK>.\r\n"
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"body": "Yeah. After reading your issue regarding subroutines in DDT, it occurred to me to do just that hack with DDT translations for advent compilation. May well do that."
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"body": "\"Where it actually put the following data\" isn't where MUDDLE intended it to be. The MUDDLE > include file defines the PURE/IMPURE macros, which let it accumulate code/data starting from two different addresses. This relies on both MIDAS and STINK to track . and the relocation offset correctly.\r\n\r\n(Edited as we've tried new versions below:)\r\n\r\nI've written a simple testcase based on these macros - https://github.com/atsampson/its-tests/tree/master/stink - and tried it with various combinations of MIDAS and STINK {\"1\" from <mdl.int> modified to ignore bad EXPUNGEs, and 201}. \"OK\" is the correct result.\r\n\r\n<table>\r\n<tr>\r\n<th>MIDAS:</th>\r\n<th>73</th>\r\n<th>76</th>\r\n<th>77</th>\r\n<th>289</th>\r\n<th>308</th>\r\n<th>323</th>\r\n<th>328</th>\r\n<th>332</th>\r\n<th>352</th>\r\n<th>458</th>\r\n</tr>\r\n<tr>\r\n<th>STINK \"1\"</th>\r\n<td>OK</td>\r\n<td>Bad1</td>\r\n<td>Bad1</td>\r\n<td>OK</td>\r\n<td>OK</td>\r\n<td>OK</td>\r\n<td>Bad3</td>\r\n<td>Bad3</td>\r\n<td>Bad3</td>\r\n<td>Bad3</td>\r\n</tr>\r\n<tr>\r\n<th>STINK 201</th>\r\n<td>OK</td>\r\n<td>Bad2</td>\r\n<td>Bad2</td>\r\n<td>Bad2</td>\r\n<td>Bad2</td>\r\n<td>Bad2</td>\r\n<td>Bad3</td>\r\n<td>Bad3</td>\r\n<td>Bad3</td>\r\n<td>Bad3</td>\r\n</tr>\r\n</table>\r\n\r\n<table>\r\n<tr>\r\n<th>\r\nOK\r\n</th>\r\n<th>\r\nBad1\r\n</th>\r\n<th>\r\nBad2\r\n</th>\r\n<th>\r\nBad3\r\n</th>\r\n</tr>\r\n<tr>\r\n<td>\r\n100/ 1,,1<br>\r\n101/ 1,,2<br>\r\n102/ 1,,3<br>\r\n103/ 1,,101<br>\r\n104/ 1,,102<br>\r\n105/ 1,,103<br>\r\n106/ 1,,201<br>\r\n107/ 1,,202<br>\r\n110/ 1,,203<br>\r\n700000/ 7,,1<br>\r\n700001/ 7,,2<br>\r\n700002/ 7,,3<br>\r\n700003/ 7,,101<br>\r\n700004/ 7,,102<br>\r\n700005/ 7,,103<br>\r\n700006/ 7,,201<br>\r\n700007/ 7,,202<br>\r\n700010/ 7,,203<br>\r\nHI=700011 LO=111\r\n</td>\r\n\r\n<td>\r\n100/ 1,,1<br>\r\n101/ 1,,2<br>\r\n102/ 1,,3<br>\r\n103/ 1,,101<br>\r\n104/ 1,,102<br>\r\n105/ 1,,103<br>\r\n106/ 1,,201<br>\r\n107/ 1,,202<br>\r\n110/ 1,,203<br>\r\n700000/ 7,,101<br>\r\n700001/ 7,,102<br>\r\n700002/ 7,,103<br>\r\n700003/ 7,,201<br>\r\n700004/ 7,,202<br>\r\n700005/ 7,,203<br>\r\nHI=700006 LO=111\r\n</td>\r\n\r\n<td>\r\n100/ 7,,101<br>\r\n101/ 7,,102<br>\r\n102/ 7,,103<br>\r\n103/ 7,,201<br>\r\n104/ 7,,202<br>\r\n105/ 7,,203<br>\r\n106/ 1,,201<br>\r\n107/ 1,,202<br>\r\n110/ 1,,203<br>\r\n700000/ 7,,1<br>\r\n700001/ 7,,2<br>\r\n700002/ 7,,3<br>\r\nHI=106 LO=111\r\n</td>\r\n\r\n<td>\r\n100/ 1,,1<br>\r\n101/ 1,,2<br>\r\n102/ 1,,3<br>\r\n103/ 1,,201<br>\r\n104/ 1,,202<br>\r\n105/ 1,,203<br>\r\n700000/ 7,,1<br>\r\n700001/ 7,,2<br>\r\n700002/ 7,,3<br>\r\n700003/ 7,,201<br>\r\n700004/ 7,,202<br>\r\n700005/ 7,,203<br>\r\nHI=700003 LO=103<br>\r\n(with MDG warnings on LO/HI)\r\n</td>\r\n</tr>\r\n</table>\r\n\r\nUnfortunately, we only have a non-MOBY version of MIDAS 73, which can't handle several of the bigger files in the MUDDLE source. I've tried binary-patching it to have a larger symbol table but it's definitely non-trivial."
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"body": "I can't find any source for MIDAS 73, but I do see sources for MIDAS 108 and 199. I wonder if those would be useful to retrieve (and build moby versions for)?"
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"body": "Similar fix for Moby MIDAS 76:\r\n\r\n```\r\n:job midas\r\n:load ts oommid\r\n36042/ .core 57\r\n36043/ .value\r\n36044/ jrst 36053\r\n:corblk fresh 4000\r\n:corblk fresh 6000\r\n:corblk fresh 10000\r\n:corblk fresh 12000\r\n:corblk fresh 14000\r\n:corblk fresh 16000\r\n:pdump ts mmid76\r\n:kill\r\n```\r\n\r\nThe same `.CBLK` hack as the above (it even happens to be at the same address), but as TS OOMMID is in PDUMP format, we need to map in some missing pages at the start. You could fix this properly by rewriting the `.CBLK` args. (Edit: better fix below.)"
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"created_at": "2018-04-18T15:45:27Z",
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"body": "Eric, we do have MIDAS 108. It's in the PDP-10/its-vault repo.\r\n\r\nI think I tried to retrieve 199, but it didn't work out. We do have a binary for 135 if that's any help."
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"body": "Ok, then @atsampson does it make sense to see if you can build a moby version of MIDAS 108 and see if that behaves as well (or better) than MIDAS 73?"
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"created_at": "2018-04-18T15:54:55Z",
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"body": "I have assembled MIDAS 108 and it's MOBY by default. I used 458 to assemble, and I don't think there were any particular problems. Maybe add a few definitions. Apparently older MIDASes had a bunch of device symbols predefined like TTY, PI, etc."
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"body": "> @larsbrinkhoff: I think there may be a bug in MIDAS 108. It doesn't seem to be processing the ^M from the command line.\r\n\r\nIn CMDL, CAIG A,40 should be CAIN A,40, else it treats all control characters as spaces. But it then crashes on my HILO2 trivial example, so there may be other things wrong with this source..."
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"body": "Oh, crashes? It built something trivial when I tried it. But then I used DDT to force it to go to CMDE at the appropriate point."
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"created_at": "2018-04-18T16:21:31Z",
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"body": "We also have SYSBIN; MIDAS 135BIN."
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"created_at": "2018-04-18T16:25:02Z",
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"body": "I've just tried a MIDAS 108 built from the source we have, but it crashes while building the HILO2/HILO3 files in my testcase. I've also tried MIDAS 352 (source from SAILDART), which behaves the same as MIDAS 458."
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"body": "Tried MIDAS 289 (purified from MIDAS BIN289). That produces the correct result with STINK 2 but not with STINK 201!"
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"body": "Seems like a hit-and-miss thing (mostly miss). Is 289 moby enough, or has an adjustable symbol table?"
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"created_at": "2018-04-19T12:04:58Z",
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"body": "MIDAS 289 does indeed have dynamic symbol table support; that was added in MIDAS 98 according to MIDAS ARCHIV. It can compile all of the <mdl.int> source with our fixes, and the resulting REL files get further in STINK than anything else I've tried so far. :-) It eventually fails in INITM when the .LOP .VALUE assertion in there fires, indicating the TVBASE table has overflowed. I've tried increasing TVLNT unsuccessfully but not looked into it any further yet.\r\n\r\nMIDAS ARCHIV also says that in MIDAS 135, as part of adding .DECTWO support, \"IT IS O.K. TO INTERSPERSE HIGH AND LOW SEGMENT CODE BY SAVING AND RESTORING THE TWO LOCATION COUNTERS\". So perhaps it worked originally, then broke at some point, then was fixed when adding .DECTWO, then broke again later...\r\n\r\nHowever, I've also had a look back at the original <mdl.int> files. There's a midas.exe in there in [TOPS-20 sharable save format](http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/dec/pdp10/TOPS20/V7/JSYS_REFERENCE.MEM.txt) - converting it with wfconv -au produces output that doesn't look quite right but does include the ASCIZ string \"CORRECTION PLEASE.\", which appears in the MIDAS 73 binary but not in 76 or later. So along with all the other evidence (BIN filenames in the STINK file, broken conditional blocks, STINK 1 not handling bad EXPUNG directives, no .SYMTAB directives in the source...) I'm pretty confident that <mdl.int> was being built with something close to MIDAS 73 rather than a later version."
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"created_at": "2018-04-19T13:00:42Z",
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"body": "MIDAS 308, which we have source for, behaves the same as MIDAS 289. (Edit: added more results above.)"
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"body": "Note that timestamps may not reflect the actual creation date. Sometimes it's the date of a copy, or a file in Saildart. In other cases there is no reliable timestamp, and it's the backup date.\r\n\r\nYear without month and day is backup date. Full date is timestamp.\r\n\r\n| File | Version | Timestamp | Source | Binary\r\n| --- | --- | --- | --- | ---\r\n| TX-0 MIDAS |\r\n| .; @ MIDAS | ? | 1972 | | yes\r\n| (DECtape) MIDAS 16K | ? | ? | | yes\r\n| MUDDLE; TS MIDAS | 73 | 1973 | | yes\r\n| AIM-147A | 75 | 1971 |\r\n| BACKUP; TS OOMIDA | 76 | 1972 | | yes\r\n| BACKUP; TS OOMMID | 76 | 1972 | | yes\r\n| BACKUP; TS OMIDAS | 77 | 1972 | | yes\r\n| BACKUP; TS OLMIDA | 77 | 1972 | | yes\r\n| BACKUP; TS OMMIDA | 77 | 1972 | | yes\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 94 | 1972-07-10\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 96 | 1972-08-10\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 98 | 1972-08-13\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 103 | 1973-02-11\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 108 | 1973-03-06\r\n| SYSENG; MIDAS 108 | 108 | 1973 | yes |\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 113 | 1973-03-27\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 119 | 1973-04-08\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 121 | 1973-04-20\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 123 | 1973-06-07\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 135 | 1974-04-01\r\n| SYSBIN; MIDAS 135BIN | 135 | 1974-03-26 | | yes\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 142 | 1974-05-01\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 185 | 1974-06-16\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 194 | 1975-01-30\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 199 | 1975-04-10\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 217 | 1976-03-17\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 234 | 1976-03-23\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 245 | 1976-04-02\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 252 | 1976-04-11\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 254 | 1976-05-16\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 255 | 1976-05-16\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 283 | 1976-08-22\r\n| BACKUP; MIDAS BIN289 | 289 | 1976-09-13 | | yes\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 290 | 1976-09-01\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 299 | 1976-09-12\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 308 | 308 | 1976-10-19 | yes\r\n| MIDAS.323[CSP,SYS] | 323 | Saildart | yes\r\n| MIDAS.328[CSP,SYS] | 328 | Saildart | yes\r\n| MIDAS.329[CSP,SYS] | 329 | Saildart | yes\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 332 | 332 | 1977-07-09 | yes\r\n| MIDAS.333[CSP,SYS] | 329 | Saildart | yes\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 343 | 343 | 1977-07-19 | yes\r\n| MIDAS.346[CSP,SYS] | 346 | Saildart | yes\r\n| MIDAS.351[CSP,SYS] | 351 | Saildart | yes\r\n| MIDAS.352[CSP,SYS] | 352 | Saildart | yes\r\n| MIDAS.353[CSP,SYS] | 353 | Saildart | yes\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 354 | 1977-10-30\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 355 | 1977-11-16\r\n| MIDAS.359[CSP,SYS] | 359 | Saildart | yes\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 390 | 1978-05-01\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 393 | 1978-06-10\r\n| MIDAS.394[CSP,SYS] | 394 | Saildart | yes\r\n| MIDAS.400[CSP,SYS] | 400 | Saildart | yes\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 402 | 1978-07-27\r\n| MIDAS.409[CSP,SYS] | 409 | Saildart | yes\r\n| INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV | 410 | 1978-11-15\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 412 | 412 | 1978-12-05 | yes\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 421 | 421 | 1980-03-05 | yes\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 433 | 433 | 1983-04-05 | yes\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 455 | 455 | 1984-01-31 | yes\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 456 | 456 | 1984-06-27 | yes\r\n| MIDAS; MIDAS 458 | 458 | 1984-10-03 | yes\r\n\r\n@eswenson1, these are the versions of MIDAS we currently have."
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"body": "Another one for the list of random fixes: to make [MIDAS 328 from SAILDART](https://www.saildart.org/MIDAS.328[CSP,SYS]) build on ITS:\r\n\r\n```\r\nIFN SMALSW,IFNDEF MACL,MACL==6000 ;(MUST BE BIG ENOUGH TO COVER INIT CODE)\r\n```\r\n\r\nought to be:\r\n\r\n```\r\nIFE SMALSW,IFNDEF MACL,MACL==6000 ;(MUST BE BIG ENOUGH TO COVER INIT CODE)\r\n```"
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"created_at": "2018-04-20T07:39:01Z",
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"body": "Duplicate of #782."
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"created_at": "2018-04-20T09:36:43Z",
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"body": "DECUSLIB10-01 has a CHESS.SAV that is claimed to be MacHack, and it's timestamped 1970. I disassembled it, but there's no use of device 130 (the 340)."
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"body": "TSRTNS = timesharing routines. It's .INSRTed when IFN TS. In MIDAS 359 it was part of the main file; some time before version 394 it was split off."
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"created_at": "2018-04-20T13:28:44Z",
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"body": "Maybe DMCG; MONIT 200 and DMCG; TS MONIT."
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"created_at": "2018-04-20T17:00:34Z",
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"body": "Not there yet, but closer. \r\n\r\nI'm pretty convinced that the failing test in INITM is buggy (testing >= rather than <=). [Using .LOP](https://github.com/atsampson/its-tests/blob/master/stink/dvalue.mid), I've had a look at the values it's testing, and they seem sensible, so I've fixed the assertion. (It's a linker-evaluated expression, so perhaps it never actually got evaluated correctly before, but I'm just guessing...)\r\n\r\nAll the MIDAS 323-compiled files now load into STINK 2. Useful commands at this point: `?` shows unresolved symbols, `-1?`shows unresolved symbols and the relocation chain for each, `S` shows resolved symbols.\r\n\r\nMost of the unresolved symbols were further ITS/TENEX conditional problems. I've pushed fixes for these to [ats/its](https://github.com/PDP-10/muddle/tree/ats/its).\r\n\r\nHowever, I'm now left with a set of unresolved symbols with names like \"TO B$F\" and \"J$XGA7\". Dropping some extra symbols into the source and looking at the output of -1?/S reveals that the locations STINK wants to write their values into are \"between files\" - i.e. adding a symbol at the end of MUDDLE's END macro and another at the beginning of the next file brackets the mystery addresses. So this looks like MIDAS doing something odd with REL output again, and the next step is to have a more careful look at the REL files.\r\n\r\n(I tried this with MIDAS 289 as well; same behaviour.)"
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"created_at": "2018-04-20T17:49:18Z",
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"body": "Excellent work! From the looks of your table, it seems like STINK \"2\" is the best bet so far.\r\n\r\nI don't think it matters, but STINK 200 is a reconstruction from binary. But done in the classic era:\r\n\r\n> Date: Tue, 11 Jun 85 05:36:46 EDT\r\n> From: Ken Harrenstien <KLH@MIT-MC.ARPA>\r\n> Subject: STINK\r\n> To: BUG-ITS@MIT-MC.ARPA\r\n>\r\n> You may find this news hard to believe.\r\n>\r\n> As you may recall, the source for STINK didn't assemble properly, and had a higher version number than the (presumably working) binary. The true source, if it ever existed, has been lost in the distant fires of ITS dump tapes being burned at the stake.\r\n>\r\n> I was thinking about a possible hack which at some point might require the services of STINK. Never mind what it is. The problem as I saw it was not the fact that STINK is unique and unsupported, but the fact that STINK could not be supported without a real source. So I made a half-hearted attempt to investigate by comparing the (faulty) result of an assembly with the existing binary, using SRCCOM's /$ switch.\r\n> \r\n> Boy, am I glad I put that hack into SRCCOM. The comparison much to my surprise showed the binaries were virtually identical, except for one changed label and a couple of missing symbols. It only took a few minutes to fix those and come up with a source that assembles into exactly the same thing (modulo .FNAM2) as the old TS STINK!\r\n> \r\n> Anyway, I wrote out this new source as STINK 200, and installed a new TS STINK. STINK lives again! (phew)"
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"body": "And let me add, that .LOP .VALUE trick is a delight!"
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"created_at": "2018-04-21T11:22:10Z",
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"body": "I've written [explain-rel](https://github.com/atsampson/its-tests/blob/master/tools/explain-rel): you give it a REL file, it feeds it through dis10 -r, and it annotates the output to explain what the REL constructs are doing. I'm using it along with my [instrumented STINK 201](https://github.com/atsampson/its-tests/blob/master/tools/astink.mid) that dumps a lot of information about what it's doing. (@larsbrinkhoff, it might also be useful for you for REL loading support in dis10.)\r\n\r\nSo far, I've found two things that MIDAS (323) is doing that confuse STINK:\r\n\r\n- When writing a \"standard data\" block to a REL file, MIDAS can split some kinds of directives (e.g. EXPUNGE) across multiple blocks in a way that the spec doesn't seem to allow, and STINK doesn't understand. Anything else in the second block is misinterpreted by STINK because it's out of sync by a word. [More details and a fix.](https://github.com/PDP-10/muddle/commit/9acab4bb48c8dc8ad66e214576db5fca12e58716) Edit: [Better fix](https://github.com/PDP-10/muddle/commit/7b287323744afbf07053e2673b2e15ce6f202db8) and [testcase](https://github.com/atsampson/its-tests/blob/master/midas/spill.mid).\r\n\r\n- ~~MIDAS emits incorrect global reference directives for [] constants~~ No, that's not right - STINK does interpret this the way MIDAS expected, but it's missing the definition of the symbol later."
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"body": "Second MIDAS bug found: it was writing out the symbol at the start of a CONSTANTS block in the wrong form. Here's [the fix to MIDAS](https://github.com/PDP-10/muddle/commit/8bfd9169aa0e4ec24cc41684c46b5f7efe1eb200) and [a testcase](https://github.com/atsampson/its-tests/blob/master/midas/const.mid).\r\n\r\nWith the versions of MIDAS and STINK in [ats/its](https://github.com/PDP-10/muddle/tree/ats/its), I can now successfully link a MUDDLE binary!\r\n\r\n```\r\n:mid289 ts m323f_midas 323\r\n:midas ts msstk_stink 2\r\n:xfile xfile muddle\r\n(snip lots of output)\r\n:msstk\r\nMMUDDLE LOADER$@$$\r\n(snip list of files)\r\n*MMUDDLE BIN$Y$$\r\n:KILL\r\n*:job muddle\r\n!\r\n*:load muddle bin\r\n*$g\r\n.VAL 0; EBPUR1>>MOVEI 1,-1(5) 1/ IMAGFL+31 E.A. _ 1\r\n```\r\n\r\nThis is about 110,000 instructions into its initialisation process, so it's making some progress at least! DDT doesn't seem to see all the symbols, although STINK can print a list of them with S$$. Single-stepping through the first few instructions fails because (in klh10, at least) it clobbers location 20, which MUDDLE wants to read early on, but setting a later breakpoint (SETUP+12) is OK.\r\n\r\nI've had a look at the TOPS-20 build files from <mdl.int> and there doesn't seem to be anything particular they're doing in terms of purification - the two binary patches they apply are to set the version number (which VCREATE can do automatically on ITS, in theory) and to twiddle another parameter that doesn't apply to ITS."
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"body": "Congratulations on getting this far! It's a milestone."
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"body": "Some more details have been published in the New Zork Times:\r\n\r\n> Although people could get runnable Zorks, they couldn’t get sources. We tried two approaches to protecting the sources (remember, there was no protection of any sort on DM): they were normally kept encrypted; and we patched the system to protect the directory where we kept the sources (named CFS, for either “Charles F. Stanley” or “Computer Fantasy and Simulation”). This worked pretty well, but was finally beaten by a system hacker from Digital: using some archaic ITS documentation (there’s never been any other kind), he was able to figure out how to modify the running operating system. Being clever, he was also able to figure out how our patch to protect the source directory worked. Then it was just a matter of decrypting the sources, but that was soon reduced to figuring out the key we’d used. Ted had no trouble getting machine time; he just found a new TOPS-20 machine that was undergoing final testing, and started a program that tried every key until it got something that looked like text. After less than a day of crunching, he had a readable copy of the source. We had to concede that anyone who’d go to that much trouble deserved it. "
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"body": "Does .INSRTs from the AI device. Fixing that, I get\r\n\r\n```\r\n*:gcmail\r\n:◊ Delete ◊\r\n*q/?U? :INPUSH :inpop\r\n*\r\n2/ 0 '◊1' ◊ \r\n3/ 0 '◊1' ◊ \r\n"
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"body": "Success:\r\n\r\n```\r\n*:mudsav;muddle\r\nMUDDLE\r\nLISTENING-AT-LEVEL 1 PROCESS 1\r\n<+ 3 4>$\r\n7\r\n```\r\n\r\nSo running the executable I built yesterday kicks off a purification process, which eventually drops you back into DDT to dump the real executable. I traced through the initialisation process, and fixed a number of problems:\r\n\r\n- The crash I was seeing yesterday was because ILOOP, which copies objects into \"pure\" storage after the end of the code, was running off the end of memory. The pure section was configured to start at BOT=700000 and it looks like it's running about 2000 words over; I've set it to 600000 for now (as MUDDLE's comments indicate that used to be its value), but I guess you could get away with 670000 or similar.\r\n\r\n- It should have printed `MUDDLE INITIALIZATION` by that point, and it hadn't. The syscall to open the TTY needed fixing (looks like a copy-and-paste error).\r\n\r\n- `FATAL ERROR CAN'T CREATE SQUOZE FILE`. It expects the MUDSAV; directory to exist; it'll write various files there (e.g. the GC code, which it maps in when needed).\r\n\r\n- `FATAL ERROR CANT FIXUP INTERPRETER`. The binary we've written so far needs to be MUDSAV;TS MUDG, in PDUMP format; MUDDLE opens the file and reads the page map out of it. So you can't use STINK's Y command, you have to drop into DDT with D and :pdump it. The MUDG name is derived from MUDDLE's version number, which should be written into MUDSTR before dumping, but it works without for now.\r\n\r\n- `FATAL ERROR INITM -- CAN'T PURIFY HIGH CORE`. By this point it's written out its executables and tried swapping in the GC, so it's mostly working. This is the last CORBLK call in PURIMP failing, trying to make all the pure-code pages read-only. I don't know why it doesn't work (any ideas?) -- so I've commented it out... which gets it to the final valret happily.\r\n\r\nI haven't tried anything more complex than arithmetic with MUDDLE yet, so it's quite likely more stuff is broken. All the changes above on the [ats/its](https://github.com/PDP-10/muddle/commits/ats/its) branch; it'd be helpful if someone else could try building it to check I've not left anything out.\r\n\r\nI found another bug in MIDAS as well: using the JRST [stuff... ? JRST .+1] idiom for a skippable block doesn't work in RELOCATABLE mode, because it treats . as the location inside the constant. Fortunately MUDDLE doesn't use this!"
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"body": "Congrats! That’s great. Now it will be interesting to see if your assembles muddle does better than the executable we tried to run zork sources with!"
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"body": "Fantastic!\r\n\r\nI'll verify that I can build this as well.\r\n\r\nI'm eager to have this merged into the its repository. I think we can use special versions of MIDAS and STINK. (There's historical precedent.) Long term, I'd like to make all necessary fixes to the latest versions."
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"created_at": "2018-04-23T05:42:01Z",
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"body": "One thing to test: garbage collection. Ensure that the mult-section GC isn't used.\r\n\r\nAlso check whether SECAGC is needed at all in the ITS version."
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"body": "I think the next version of MIDAS should be 459 rather than incremented for every bugfix or git commit."
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"body": "Also add the INFO; MIDAS ARCHIV file."
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"body": "@atsampson has a version of his own: \r\nhttps://stuff.offog.org/ats.evars"
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"created_at": "2018-04-23T13:37:03Z",
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"body": "There's also [the EMACS vt100 library](https://github.com/PDP-10/its/blob/master/src/emacs1/vt100.49), which includes the cursor keys amongst other bindings."
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"body": "MIDAS 323, STINK \"2\", and Muddle (to be 56?) are now built in the ats/muddle branch.\r\n\r\nOne strange thing is that STINK doesn't print its \"*\" prompt. EDIT: When run in Travis CI."
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"body": "This is apparently due to the %OPDDT job options bit being set. DDT sets it in all its inferiors.\r\n\r\nIt looks like it should deposit something in the Q accumulator. Q should be defined.\r\n\r\nRunning this from Puff the Magic Dragon ought to work."
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"created_at": "2018-04-23T17:56:44Z",
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"body": "I made the link in my test ITS. Should know in an hour if GCMAIL did its job."
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"created_at": "2018-04-23T18:00:10Z",
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"body": "I did a quick test leaving out AMSGC REL from the link. UTILIT wants IAMSGC, and LOADGC wants MARK2S and SLENGC. No other undefined symbols."
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"created_at": "2018-04-23T18:01:05Z",
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"body": "Quite funny, actually. The Multics emacs chart command had the same problem -- it generated a bad year as well. But the Multics emacs is written in MacLisp -- and the ITS version in TECO."
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"created_at": "2018-04-23T18:07:29Z",
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"body": "Oops, that was the wrong garbage collector!\r\n\r\nSECAGC is indeed not needed in ITS Muddle."
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"created_at": "2018-04-23T18:19:15Z",
"updated_at": "2018-04-23T18:25:56Z",
"author_association": "MEMBER",
"body": "> The pure section was configured to start at BOT=700000 and it looks like it's running about 2000 words over; I've set it to 600000 for now\r\n\r\nMaybe you should use TXPURE instead of PURE?\r\n\r\nEDIT: Looks like it's for TENEX."
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"body": "As far as I remember, the language was MDL, but the interpreter was called MUDDLE. TS MDL seems wrongdoings me. The executable was called TS MUDDLE."
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T06:05:58Z",
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"body": "I'll note that the 1973 version includes a TS MUDDLE. TOPS-20 executables are named MDL10*n*.EXE. Adam, you found a reference to TS MDL in some manual?"
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T06:26:22Z",
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"body": "I don't know which version this is, but it's close to 421: \r\nhttps://github.com/PDP-10/sri-nic/blob/master/files/src/utilities/midas.mid"
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T07:04:22Z",
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"body": "The link didn't make GCMAIL delete files from .MAIL.\r\n\r\nBut I ran it in DDT clearing the %OPDDT bit. The files were removed. So maybe I didn't make the link right, or Puff didn't pick it up."
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T07:04:52Z",
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"body": "I'll hold off merging this until MDL is in."
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"body": "I don't know how the Name Dragon was started."
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T08:46:30Z",
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"body": "Related to #830."
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T09:50:14Z",
"updated_at": "2018-04-24T15:46:18Z",
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"body": "Random notes:\r\n\r\n- I believe there should be a SYS*n*; TS ZORK. (Historically, *n* ∈ { 1, 2, 3 })\r\n- Maybe the source code should be moved to CFS.\r\n- The default location for the Zork save file in ITS is CFS; MADADV SAVE.\r\n- Zork seems to prefer MDL 104 (and 54?); there could be incompatible differences in 106/56.\r\n- The TOPS-20 build script starts with loading M104UNI. What's that, maybe a pre-built \"universe\" populated with libraries?\r\n- Next, it loads LITLPK.GBIN. What is that?"
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T09:51:00Z",
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"body": "I think we could use some Muddle eyeballs on build.cmd and rooms.394. @36bit?"
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T10:14:46Z",
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"body": "- ITS-GET-NAME retrieves information from the INQUIR database (or DM equivalent?). We probably don't have that library.\r\n- Funny symbols: REMARKABLY-DISGUSTING-CODE, EXCRUCIATINGLY-UNTASTEFUL-CODE, etc.\r\n- TELL 152 is mostly written in assembly language. Do we have that assembler?"
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"created_at": "2018-04-24T10:42:42Z",
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"body": "TS MDL came from Chapter 1 of the 55/105 manual:\r\n\r\n> Somehow get the interpreter running -- the program in the file SYS:TS MDL in the ITS version or SYS:MDL.SAV in the Tenex version or SYS:MDL.EXE in the Tops-20 version. [...] The program will be referred to as just \"MDL\" (or \"the interpreter\") from here on.\r\n\r\nThere's a comment in the source that suggest TS MUDDLE was a previous name, though:\r\n\r\n> ; HACK FOR TS FOO linked to TS MUDDLE\r\n\r\nWe could install it under both names?"
}
]
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